Liliputin - 5048

Bridge to Nowhere? There is no there there ... "
Sarah Palin

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In 2005, the United States Congress passed an omnibus spending bill that contained a $442 million earmark for constructing two Alaskan bridges. Pushed forward by Alaska Representative Don Young and Senator Ted Stevens, the Gravina Island Bridge was intended to provide a link between the Ketchikan airport on Gravina Island and the city of Ketchikan at a cost of $233 million in federal grant money. It received nationwide attention as a symbol of pork-barrel spending. Since Gravina Island only had a population of 50, the bridge became known as the "Bridge to Nowhere" during the run-up to the 2008 presidential election.

Bridge to Nowhere

In 2002, it was proposed that a for-profit prison corporation, Cornell Corrections, build a prison on Gravina Island. To connect Gravina with nearby Ketchikan, on Revillagigedo Island, it was originally planned that the federal government spend $175 million on building a bridge and another $75 million to connect it to the power grid with an electrical intertie. The Ketchikan Borough Assembly turned the proposal down when the administration of Governor Tony Knowles also expressed its disfavor with the idea. Eventually, the corporation's prison plans led to the exposure of the wide-ranging Alaska political corruption probe, which eventually ensnared Alaska's U.S. Senator Ted Stevens. The bridge idea persisted through the administration of former U.S. senator and then-governor Frank Murkowski. The 2005 Highway Bill provided for $223m to build the Gravina Island Bridge. The provisions and earmarks were negotiated by Alaska's Rep. Don Young, who chaired the House Transportation Committee, and were supported by the chair of the Senate Appropriations Committee, Ted Stevens. This bridge, nicknamed "The Bridge to Nowhere" by critics, was intended to replace the auto ferry that is currently the only connection between Ketchikan and its airport. While the federal earmark was withdrawn after meeting opposition from Oklahoma Senator Tom Coburn, the state of Alaska still received $300 million in transportation funding, with which the state of Alaska continued to study improvements in access to the airport, which conceivably could include improvements to the ferry service. In 2006, Palin had run for governor with a "build-the-bridge" plank in her platform, saying she would "not allow the spinmeisters to turn this project ... into something that's so negative." Palin criticized the use of the word "nowhere" as insulting to local residents and urged speedy work on building the infrastructure "while our congressional delegation is in a strong position to assist." Despite the demise of the bridge proposal, Palin spent $26 million in transportation funding for the planned 3-mile access road on Gravina island that ultimately had little use. A spokesman for Alaska's Department of Transportation said that it had been within Palin's power to cancel the road project but noted the state was considering cheaper designs to complete the bridge project, and that in any case the road would open up the surrounding lands for development. As governor, Palin canceled the Gravina Island Bridge in September 2007, saying that Congress had "little interest in spending any more money" due to "inaccurate portrayals of the projects." Alaska did not return the $442 million in federal transportation funds.

In 2008, as a vice-presidential candidate, Palin characterized her position as having told Congress "thanks, but no thanks, on that bridge to nowhere." A number of Ketchikan residents said that the claim was false and a betrayal of Palin's previous support for their community. Some critics said that her statement was misleading, as she had expressed support for the spending project and kept the federal money after the project was canceled.

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Phrase there is no there there (idiomatic)

The indicated thing, person, or other matter has no distinctive identity, or no
significant characteristics, or no functional center point; nothing significant exists in that place; nothing significant is occurring in that situation.

there is no there there

English
Alternative forms
there's no there there
there's no "there" there
there is no "there" there
Etymology
From a remark by Gertrude Stein in Everybody's Autobiography (1937), concerning the fact that her childhood home in Oakland, California no longer existed.

Phrase
there is no there there

(idiomatic) The indicated thing, person, or other matter has no distinctive identity, or no significant characteristics, or no functional center point; nothing significant exists in that place; nothing significant is occurring in that situation.
Further reading

See also
wherever you go, there you are

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there's no there there
A descriptive phrase (originally coined by Gertrude Stein) now used to convey an utter lack of substance or veracity as it pertains to the subject under discussion.

Alternatively, the phrase can be used as a literal absence of a physical location.
Bush and Cheney keep screaming about a link between Iraq and al Queda, but there's no there there.

I went searching for Atlantis, but there's no there there.
August 11, 2006

***

Is ‘There is no there there’ a normal and very natural expression?
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4


Is ‘There is no there there’ a normal and very natural expression?

I was amused to find the phrase, ‘There is no there there’ in the article titled, ‘Wrong resume’ in today’s New York Times commenting on Mitt Romney’s proposition for amending the Constitution to require the President to have at least three years business experience before he could become president of the United States.’.

It reads:


“Romney has made business experience the main reason to elect him. Without his business past or his projections of business future, there is no there there. But history shows that time in the money trade is more often than not a prelude to a disastrous presidency. The less experience in business, the better the president.”

I interpreted ‘there is no there there’ means ‘without his business experience, there is no place of success that he enjoys today. Though spell-checker keeps demanding me to delete one of three theres there from the text I’m typing in, I don’t think there’s any grammatical problem with this line. However, it makes me hiccup for unknown reason.

Is this just a pun of words played by the writer? Is it 'cool' or a very normal and natural expression?

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edited Jul 10, 2013 at 20:45
asked Jun 2, 2012 at 0:54
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Yoichi Oishi
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This phrase was coined by Gertrude Stein, as a Google search quickly reveals. –
Mark Beadles
 Jun 2, 2012 at 1:28
Fun fact: you can't translate this sentence into Russian, because there is no "there is" there. –
RegDwigнt
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11

The original is from Gertrude Stein in a quote about her birthplace, Oakland CA.

It's not natural but it works. It is not a pun or a play on words, but is just clever by using 'there' in three slightly different senses.

There is no there there

The first instance is simply the existential nonreferential 'there is'.

The second is making a noun out of 'there' by having an adjective modify it 'no there', which is a figurative use of 'there' meaning place, no sense of location.

The third is just the usual adverbial answer to 'where?', at -that- location, referring specifically to Oakland in the quote.

The meaning of the entire sentence is that she didn't find a sense of place, a center, or really anything substantial or important enough to be warranted calling the town of Oakland some place by even a name. She's just belittling her home town.

Now as to the use of the quote in the passage, it is trying to say that the person has no other qualities to recommend him without the business experience.

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edited Jun 2, 2012 at 2:34
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Jim
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answered Jun 2, 2012 at 1:48
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Mitch
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Which is completely different than the "Soothing words a nanny might say to a small child, "There There. It'll be alright." –
Jim
 Jun 2, 2012 at 2:33
Right answer, thought states only the obvious. Would have been helpful if the context of the quote were included and source cited. +1 All the same. –
Kris
 Feb 23, 2013 at 5:48
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8

This phrase famously appeared in Gertrude Stein's book, Everybody’s Autobiography, where it specifically refers to Oakland, CA. Although I've long supposed she referred to the blandness or colorlessness of Oakland, tenderbuttons.com says it refers to the occasion when she wanted to visit her childhood home in Oakland, CA but could not find the house. (Which might amount to the same thing, many of the houses and neighborhoods looking much alike.) Anyhow, the common interpretation of this phrase, so far as I'm aware, is that it says something has no important essence.

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answered Jun 2, 2012 at 1:34
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James Waldby - jwpat7
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"...Not of course the house, the house the big house and the big garden and the eucalyptus trees and the rose hedge naturally were not there any longer existing, what was the use ...

"It is a funny thing about addresses where you live. When you live there you know it so well that it is like an identity a thing that is so much a thing that it could not ever be any other thing..."

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answered Feb 23, 2013 at 2:28
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BeThereAnon
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It is perfectly normal. It is also lacking in punctuation. The second there needs to be in quotes for it to make sense. To me, the quote is similar to old Will Shakespeare saying "much ado about nothing." The user is simply saying "you are making an issue out of something that is either extremely trivial or does not exist."

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edited Jul 9, 2013 at 13:24
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RegDwigнt;
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Foghorn Tom
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-1

The sentence is nonsensical; "there" means "in that place".

So "There's no there there" means, "There's no in that place in that place" which makes no sense.

What the person should write or say is, "There's no evidence (or substance) there", for the sentence to make sense.

The word "there" is used incorrectly as a substitute for "evidence" or "substance".

It's incorrect usage because "there" has a totally different meaning than "evidence" or "substance".

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edited Mar 26, 2017 at 16:40
answered Mar 26, 2017 at 16:34
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Tony Max
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As the other answers point out, it's a famous literary quote, which has become an idiom. Writers have artistic license to play with language, and one definition of an idiom is a phrase that has meaning that is not decipherable from the plain meaning of the words. So by either standard this expression is "sensible". –
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 Mar 26, 2017 at 16:58
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-1

I think it does need punctuation, but, for me, the missing punctuation is a comma between the second and third theres: i.e. "There's no there, there".

If we refer back to Stein's original statement, the gist of what she's trying to say is something along the lines of, "That place (the house), in that place (Oakland) is not there".

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answered Nov 10, 2017 at 13:59
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Donach Malachy
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The sentence is less controversial without the insertion of a punctuation. A comma between there and there (there, there) will not have the same effect as in 'very, very much'. A comma, in this case, will only produce linguistic confusion.

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edited Jan 28, 2018 at 10:55
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JMP
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answered Jan 28, 2018 at 10:23
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Denis Austin
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There is no connotation of Oakland being bland. It's simply that Gertrude Stein's childhood home on 10 acres had been razed to the ground. It no longer existed, replaced with smaller lots and houses.

In context the phrase is about Stein's own sense of identity bound up with a feeling of place she'd long associated with her home and garden in Oakland. From her description of seeing it all gone on a trip back years later, there's no other conclusion for the reader than a sense of loss. One might also infer emptiness, wistfulness, and elusiveness of identity as well.

Although the colloquial use of the phrase There's no there there has developed its own meaning and is an apt way to describe a person, place, or thing lacking substance, the original context is entirely different.

A side note for anyone who's never been to Oakland: An 8' high sculpture of powder-coated steel plate letters stands on the border between Berkeley and Oakland at the convergence of Adeline Street and MLK Jr Way. Traveling into Oakland from Berkeley, the letters say THERE. Approaching Berkeley, the letters on the Oakland side say HERE - as though to say, yes, there IS a there there, and it's here! It's a literary nod, a whimsical way of saying Hello and Goodbye to either or both towns. It is also visible from the BART train just before the tracks go underground. The sculpture was created in 2005.

there is no there there (idiomatic)